Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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mattias
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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Mattias Säfsten (fd Sandgren)
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Leiffi
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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mattias skrev: mån apr 12, 2021 6:21 pm https://youtu.be/m6vocc_6YaI :hey:
Easy to see boostleak , will be fixed before next dyno session. Also added some timing after that , smoke cleared quite a bit.

Hub dyno is the only way to go , rollers start to slip before 1000 hp.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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This summers competitions , with modified turbo and added timing and fuel after dyno.

https://youtu.be/NOXkGMHUioA

https://youtube.com/shorts/X7nmLwACIAY?feature=share
Erland Cox
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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What has been done inside the engine?
I have ported some pulling heads and have just done a set of Perkins V8 heads and a huge 6 cylinder, IH I belive,

Erland
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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Erland Cox skrev: lör okt 09, 2021 10:14 am What has been done inside the engine?
I have ported some pulling heads and have just done a set of Perkins V8 heads and a huge 6 cylinder, IH I belive,

Erland
Nothing. Scania 4-valve heads look quite good , separate intake ports , nice SSR. Ofcourse they are raw from serialproduction so some finishing touches would help some. Exhaust side maybe not so good.

Here in Finland hard to find someone who wants to touch diesel heads and iron heads.

And many pullers believe that porting does not help diesels , just add boost. And some believe that just make them as big as possible , shape doesnt matter.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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The heads that I have ported are for engines that are not allowed to rev more than 3200 rpm.
There are other rules as well but I do not know them.
A big Ford 2 valve inline six that I ported gave 1900 hp and 5000 Nm if I remember correctly.
But that is with a boost pressure around 7 bars.

Erland
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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It would be nice if you could tell what was done to the turbo? Turbo size is most important factor on theese engines and makes a lot more than porting the head.
But most important of all is management of diesel supply.

Looking at the boost gauge on your clip, says that you are not "giving all you got" :angryfire: :thumbright:
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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whilliam skrev: sön okt 10, 2021 5:42 pm It would be nice if you could tell what was done to the turbo? Turbo size is most important factor on theese engines and makes a lot more than porting the head.
But most important of all is management of diesel supply.

Looking at the boost gauge on your clip, says that you are not "giving all you got" :angryfire: :thumbright:
HX60 with 92mm turbine and 40 housing. Comp wheel my own design 81mm.

Nozzles +80% honed.

I knew intercooler is leaking but just 3 days ago finally tested it , it doesnt hold any pressure , leaks everywhere , so there's more to get from this engine. I think I can get +1400 hp with same turbo.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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I reckon that you have the Scania 97x92mm 12 blade. There is a Cummins 100x86.5mm 11 blade that works good, especially if you try it with a housing for 92mm, it does not loose that much spool and gives a really noticeable peak at max.

Of course, you can benefit from even bigger turbine wheel, as long as there is big exducer on compressorside it is always good to aim for bigger turbine.

Please explain "nozzels +80% honed"


Yeeea... It is a hard work to try and "turbo the whole world" by letting it out thrue I/C
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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whilliam skrev: tis okt 12, 2021 1:04 am I reckon that you have the Scania 97x92mm 12 blade. There is a Cummins 100x86.5mm 11 blade that works good, especially if you try it with a housing for 92mm, it does not loose that much spool and gives a really noticeable peak at max.

Of course, you can benefit from even bigger turbine wheel, as long as there is big exducer on compressorside it is always good to aim for bigger turbine.

Please explain "nozzels +80% honed"


Yeeea... It is a hard work to try and "turbo the whole world" by letting it out thrue I/C
No , 92mm housing with 86,5mm turbine does not work at all.

Extrude honed nozzles.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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The turbine extracts power in two areas. Inducer (radial turbine) and Exducer (axial turbine) it is easy to think that each of them is giving 50/50 to the shaft, but that is not true. All of the working range the power from each of them is different with the radial one making most at spool and the axial "kicking in" at bigger flow.

When you allow the exducer to "leak" it is the same "thinking" as making cut back on wheel and that is perfectly "normal" (it is done even by some big/main turbomanufacturer) But the truth is that making the exhaust housing outlet bigger is more effective than "cut back wheels"
The only drawback is that it looks weird.

We have different approach how to make the turbo more effective and we could leave it at that. (what i suggest work well but you do not want to try it)

Extrude honing, i think you talk about the scroll (the whole area from inlet to nozzle) and that is what we do with porting (to take control of the angle of gas-stream to turbine wheel)

The turbos is beeing more and more effective with smaller housings and bigger wheels, in our experience.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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whilliam skrev: tis okt 12, 2021 10:07 am The turbine extracts power in two areas. Inducer (radial turbine) and Exducer (axial turbine) it is easy to think that each of them is giving 50/50 to the shaft, but that is not true. All of the working range the power from each of them is different with the radial one making most at spool and the axial "kicking in" at bigger flow.

When you allow the exducer to "leak" it is the same "thinking" as making cut back on wheel and that is perfectly "normal" (it is done even by some big/main turbomanufacturer) But the truth is that making the exhaust housing outlet bigger is more effective than "cut back wheels"
The only drawback is that it looks weird.

We have different approach how to make the turbo more effective and we could leave it at that. (what i suggest work well but you do not want to try it)

Extrude honing, i think you talk about the scroll (the whole area from inlet to nozzle) and that is what we do with porting (to take control of the angle of gas-stream to turbine wheel)

The turbos is beeing more and more effective with smaller housings and bigger wheels, in our experience.
"You" are the only ones who use messed up exhaust housings and think it works.

I mean injector nozzles , oversized through extrude honing , flows 80% more than original. Thats nozzle flow only , without needle , in reality complete unit injector seems to flow about 55% more than stock.
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Re: Scania R500 @ hub dyno

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Ahhh... That is another thing! More diesel is always needed :thumbright:

Regarding turbine housing and porting there is a lot more for you too experience. It has been done in many, many years and many people have done it with different progress.
Why not everyone is doing it is because of that it is complicated in many ways. (both how to shape them and how to find good tools)

The castings is never "perfect" and there is differences in them as well. Send me a couple of housings and i will tell which one of them giving you the best performance (all without modification)

The situation is the same with the cylinder heads, a good flow-expert, could look at the heads and tell wich one is best suited for power.
And i have never seen anybody telling that a head is "messed up" if proven working well.
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